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@Mar9112: Thanks for the news. The law still needs to be officially published to enter into force, which is expected in August.[1] The article and map should be updated after that. Heitordp (talk) 15:48, 17 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
@Kwamikagami: Jalisco is already shown on the map in purple (allowing abortion, with unclear gestational limit), because the court invalidated the respective section of its penal code and ordered the legislature to change it. Heitordp (talk) 14:44, 18 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
It's not on the map for Mexico. Didn't know if it should count if the leg hasn't done anything yet; maybe it should if we follow how we treated SSM. — kwami (talk) 18:54, 18 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Hi there, the current lead image for this page seems to differ a lot from the lead image used in the Abortion in the United States article.
I just wanted to know if this image needs to be updated (to reflect on the wide bans amognst US states), or if the current image in the US article needs to be updated to fix these differences.
I am not an expert on US abortion law, so would value any input. It looks like some states, like Texas for example, have banned abortion for most cases, with some exceptions. However, having read about these exceptions, it seems doctors are hesitant to even allow these as the law is vague. Capturing these differences between legal and social reality would be helpful. For example, Texas could be edited so that a red and black lines are present through the state to highlight this complication. Jamzze (talk) 09:05, 26 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
@Jamzze: The maps are consistent with each other, they just show different aspects at different levels of detail. Neither map needs to be updated.
The map in the article Abortion law shows in which circumstances abortion is allowed: red, orange, brown, pink and yellow for abortion allowed only in certain circumstances (each color represents a different set of circumstances), and blue for abortion allowed merely by the woman's request, also called elective abortion (3 shades of blue representing ranges of gestational limits).
The map in the article Abortion in the United States only shows abortion on request. All states that allow abortion only in certain circumstances, but not on request, are shown in black. This map doesn't differentiate between the circumstances. For the states that allow abortion on request, this map uses 10 colors to represent gestational limits more precisely.
The states in red, orange, brown, pink and yellow in the first map are all black in the second map. The states in dark blue in the first map are purple, pink or red in the second map. The states in medium blue in the first map are various shades of blue in the second map. The states in light blue in the first map are green in the second map.
The law in Texas allows abortion only to save the woman's life, so the map shows it this way. Some doctors may be hesitant in cases where it's uncertain whether the pregnancy really poses a risk to life, but if it does, there is no question that the law allows abortion. So the state shouldn't be shown in black, even if striped. The map only considers the law, not practice, which can be subjective, and it doesn't show stripes for any jurisdiction. For example, the law in Guam allows abortion on request, so it's shown in blue, even though no doctors in Guam perform abortions except to save the woman's life; conversely, the law in Curaçao only allows abortion to save the woman's life, so it's shown in red, even though doctors there normally perform abortions on request. Heitordp (talk) 00:04, 27 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Shouldn't Ethiopia be green? The law explicitly allows it in the case of "extreme poverty" in the same way that they allow it in the cases of rape, incest, and fetal defects. Scorpions1325 (talk) 14:24, 5 August 2024 (UTC)[reply]
@Scorpions1325: The law reduces the penalty, but doesn't eliminate it, in case of extreme poverty, so it can't be considered to allow abortion in this case. It's in a different article and not in the same way as the cases where the law allows abortion without penalty.[3] I clarified the note in the table.
The law also allows abortion if the woman is under age 18 or has a disability, but I think that these conditions are too limited, and more related to health than social or economic, to justify showing Ethiopia in green on the map. The Faroe Islands have similar conditions and are also shown in yellow. The countries in green allow abortion in much broader circumstances that are almost considered as on request, such as India and the UK. Heitordp (talk) 16:13, 5 August 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Scorpions1325, The abortion law of Maryland says that "the state may not interfere" with abortion in certain circumstances: before viability, or at any time in case of risk to life or health or fetal abnormality.[4] This law on its own doesn't explicitly prohibit any abortion, but a separate law criminalizes the killing of a fetus outside the circumstances listed in the abortion law.[5] When the abortion law was made in 1991,[6] and until earlier this year, sources interpreted it as prohibiting abortion outside the circumstances listed,[7][8][9] but now some of the same sources say that the law doesn't prohibit anything.[10][11] I don't know what led them to change their interpretation. The abortion law was changed in 2022 only to allow more types of medical professionals to perform abortions,[12] but the rest of the law remains unchanged. The new interpretation doesn't seem to be the intent of the law, because otherwise the list of circumstances would be pointless. At least some sources still maintain the earlier interpretation.[13][14]Heitordp (talk) 06:42, 7 August 2024 (UTC)[reply]
3Kingdoms, Article 218a of the German criminal code says that "the elements of the offence under section 218 are not deemed fulfilled" if the woman requests the abortion, obtains counseling, and the abortion is done by a physician in the first 12 weeks of pregnancy.[15] The law was written this way, instead of explicitly saying that abortion is allowed in these conditions, to satisfy a constitutional interpretation. German sources usually describe it as "unlawful but unpunishable", but this distinction is pointless. The UN source used as a basis for the table in this article, cited above the table, as well as many other sources, simply list Germany as allowing abortion on request in the first 12 weeks.[16] Some other countries also write their laws similarly, prohibiting abortion in general and only removing the penalty in certain cases, and they are also considered to allow abortion in these cases. So based on these sources, and for consistency, Germany should remain dark blue on the map. In the table in the article, the last 3 columns for Germany are in light green, meaning permitted with complex legality, with a note explaining the details. Heitordp (talk) 04:53, 18 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]